New Wave Outpost Forum

Anyone else on the board have the Japanese 24-bit K2 remaster of Pelican West Plus? It seems like whoever was remastering this was careless enough to leave a huge pop (like that of vinyl) on Love Plus One (Track 2) at 2:48. I've now checked a second copy for this and it's there. I highly doubt the song has this inherently. Just wondering if anyone else has noticed...

Edward

I didn't get this album but I'm noticing a growing trend of poorly remastered cd's. What's going on? They have to hire some new people for this job.

Funny, I just downloaded this song from iTunes from the 1988 reissue to check for a third time and to calm my OCD. The pop is there as well. Bizarre.

Edward

[quote][i]Originally posted by Abacab[/i]
<br>Funny, I just downloaded this song from iTunes from the 1988 reissue to check for a third time and to calm my OCD. The pop is there as well. Bizarre.

Edward
[/quote]

Send me a copy and I'll take the 'pop' out for you.

<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v647/dbince/eight.gif"><img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v647/dbince/number6.gif">

[quote][i]Originally posted by Sean[/i]
<br>I didn't get this album but I'm noticing a growing trend of poorly remastered cd's. What's going on? They have to hire some new people for this job.
[/quote]

I think you'll find that as time passes and more and more master tapes slowly turn to mush, restoring from available vinyl will be the only option for re-issues from 20+ years ago. My guess would be that they are batch processing the files and not reviewing each song individually. Surely, a pop that noticeable shouldn't make it to a final pressing without being caught.

<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v647/dbince/eight.gif"><img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v647/dbince/number6.gif">

A lot of pops that appear on remastered CD's are static discharges as they run the master tapes through the player. Magnetics build up on tape mediums over the years, and they are gradually released when the tape is played. This can sometimes result in a static pop, not unlike laundry pulled out of the dryer. If I actually worked in the "real" world of CD mastering, I would fast forward all tapes through to the end, rewind, then give it a go. It helps release magnetics and minimize these static pops. As far as dying masters go, many have been saved by using a "baking" method that renders (most) tapes usable again. For some tapes it's just too late. For others they are only able to save part of the tape, but I'm not sure if this is supposed to be a permanant fix

Most people in the world of CD mastering are not necessarily audiophiles. I have heard CD's done by "award winning" technicians, and hear very bad judgement calls when they mastered certain CD's. With as bad as it's gotten since the mid-90's, if I buy a reissue that actually sounds good, I consider myself lucky.
Some recent reissues that I have been very satisfied with: The Cure re-issues and the B Sides box set are stunning. The Siouxsie "The Scream" remaster is amazing. One batch that was pretty good, but suffered from some bad judgement are the Boomtown Rats catalog. The CD's were turned up so loud that the actual audio files have distortion in them. Mondo Bongo was the biggest culprit. I would love to get my hands on those masters and do a fresh batch.

Scott

[quote][i]Originally posted by eight6[/i]
<br>[quote][i]Originally posted by Abacab[/i]
<br>Funny, I just downloaded this song from iTunes from the 1988 reissue to check for a third time and to calm my OCD. The pop is there as well. Bizarre.

Edward
[/quote]

Send me a copy and I'll take the 'pop' out for you.

<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v647/dbince/eight.gif"><img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v647/dbince/number6.gif">
[/quote]

Copy of the CD or of the track?

Edward

Yeah, I have a couple of remasters that are done either poorly or have noticeable flaws... The Police digipak of Zenyatta has "static crackles" right off the top of the first song. This is highly annoying, considering that when I borrowed the original 1987 CD from a friend and it sounds just fine.

Coincidentally my CD of Haircut 100's last remaster (the 2003 European version) had a channel problem off the top of one of the first two tracks, can't remember which one, I am 99% sure it was "Love Plus One" as well... but in addition to your popping noise, one of the channels drops off in the beginning. Same goes with my Skinny Puppy "Videos" DVD on Nettwerk. One of the channels on one of the live tracks just pops off and then comes back on and off again throughout the whole song! Amazing stuff.

I assume things can't be right all of the time... but if a CD or DVD is going to be marketed as "REMASTERED" perhaps they should do a better job of actually remastering it. Ministry's latest remasters on Rykodisc, at least the first batch, had the "studio raw" mix pressed onto the CD's and shipped out! Check out the band's web site... This meant there was no low end and the mix sounded nice and tinny. C'mon guys! Get it right.

Sometimes "remaster" CD's are from the original first run CD from the 80's in some cases because the master tapes are now shot and tracking down the vinyl masters prove to be impossible (warehouse fires, poor storage, lost tapes, etc.).... So in some cases this means they take the CD's we bought the first time around in 1986 make the mix louder and deeper, clean it up a little bit, throw some new artwork and a couple of new pictures in the booklet, and then sell it as a newly remastered CD!!! WHOOOO!!! Sometimes in the case of old punk and indie stuff they have to master songs from old cassette tapes and even MP3's.

I do appreciate the addition of remastered CD having new songs and old b-sides tacked on them. Now if they could just get both parts of the process right! Hell, I've even noticed CD artwork that was clearly scanned off the original CD's artwork, which means they didn't even take the time to re-process the artwork with any care.

The short end of it is everything in the music industry (or any industry for that matter) is about making MONEY. Bottom line... making moolah!!! The record companies could care less if they ever have to put out another Haircut 100 album again (let alone seeing an album that obscure get remastered properly).

I am beginning to think that the K2 remaster came directly from the old reissue rather than the master tapes. I find it inconceivable that they both happen to have the pop at the same point if they weren't essentially the same thing. As the above post says, take the old issue, make it sound a little deeper and louder (as a lot of first gen CDs lack volume and bass) and call it a "remastered" product. I was a huge proponent of buying Japanese issue CDs as they seemed to be the best around until the past few I received. The Haircut 100 Pelican West, the Nick Heyward North of a Miracle K2 remaster and the mini-LP Private Eyes remaster. If anyone has the paper sleeve/mini-LP remaster, check out "I Can't Go For That (No Can Do)" at around 2:15 and you should hear a little static come out of the left channel. Coincidentally, these are all BMG products. Go figure.

Edward

[quote][i]Originally posted by Abacab[/i]
<br>[quote][i]Originally posted by eight6[/i]
<br>[quote][i]Originally posted by Abacab[/i]
<br>Funny, I just downloaded this song from iTunes from the 1988 reissue to check for a third time and to calm my OCD. The pop is there as well. Bizarre.

Edward
[/quote]

Send me a copy and I'll take the 'pop' out for you.

<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v647/dbince/eight.gif"><img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v647/dbince/number6.gif">
[/quote]

Copy of the CD or of the track?

Edward
[/quote]

For now, send me the track via e-mail. Mp3's aren't the best format to restore, because the file is in a somewhat compressed state, but as it's only one pop, I should have no trouble removing it. If you would like a duplicate of the CD minus the pop, you can send that to me through the mail and I'll fix it for you.


<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v647/dbince/eight.gif"><img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v647/dbince/number6.gif">

I sent you a copy of the MP3 at 192kbps. If you'd prefer, as I said in the e-mail, I can send you a lossless version (though it will be large). I have also written an e-mail to BMG of Japan regarding this matter and another problem I've had (and will create a topic for in this forum about). Hopefully, despite it being a Japanese site, they will reply to my issue.

Edward

[quote][i]Originally posted by Abacab[/i]
<br>I sent you a copy of the MP3 at 192kbps. If you'd prefer, as I said in the e-mail, I can send you a lossless version (though it will be large). I have also written an e-mail to BMG of Japan regarding this matter and another problem I've had (and will create a topic for in this forum about). Hopefully, despite it being a Japanese site, they will reply to my issue.

Edward
[/quote]

I've returned the file to you sans glitch. IMO, that song was obviously sourced from vinyl, and has many other small clicks and pops in it (try listening using a good pair of headphones). I also suspect that the file was "over processed" and I've included a bit more info on that in the e-mail I've sent you.

I don't buy many CD's, as most of what I listen to barely made it to vinyl, so I'm not holding out hope of it ever making it to CD, but if this is an example of what I can expect, I'll just keep restoring stuff for my own personal use.

Best of luck with the folks at BMG, I think you'll need it.

<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v647/dbince/eight.gif"><img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v647/dbince/number6.gif">

I have no confidence I'll get any response whatsoever. Regardless, I am going to try. I sent you another e-mail, by the way. I am, however, confident that this "K2 remaster" is merely the old reissue reprocessed. As I said earlier, this same pop occurs in the track from the old 1988 reissue that appears on iTunes. How unfortunate.

Edward

[quote][i]Originally posted by Abacab[/i]
<br>I have no confidence I'll get any response whatsoever. Regardless, I am going to try. I sent you another e-mail, by the way. I am, however, confident that this "K2 remaster" is merely the old reissue reprocessed. As I said earlier, this same pop occurs in the track from the old 1988 reissue that appears on iTunes. How unfortunate.

Edward
[/quote]


I'm surprised that nobody caught that one, it was a pretty big pop. I've fixed up the other track (that type of noise was a bit different than the first file you sent), but I think if you listen to that track you'll hear more of the same in spots.

<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v647/dbince/eight.gif"><img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v647/dbince/number6.gif">