New Wave Outpost Forum

What really distinguishes the two? Is there a 'signature' US sound or influence that set them apart from their compatriots overseas?

It depends on what you consider post-punk...cause some people consider some bands as merely punk, others consider the same bands as post-punk and others consider the same bands as new-wave.
But I think that what I consider post-punk has been a bigger and more varied movement in the UK than in the US. For example, in the UK we got many different bands that fall into the post-punk category: Joy Division (well, some people see them as new wave), Magazine, Wire, The Fall, The Jam (well, they are somewhere between punk and post-punk).
If you aske me about US post-punk... it's even harder to make a difference between the three genres. Cause I don't feel as if Blondie was esctrictly punk.. the same applies for Television. Or Talking Heads... there was no "new wave" apelation when they came out.
And (for instance) take Elvis Costello, i'd put him into post-ponk though many people would put him into new-wave.
This is a rather difficult affair in my opinion.

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Just heard an excellent podcast with a guy who wrote a new book about post-punk. The book is called "Rip It Up & Start Again: Postpunk 1978-1984" I haven't read it yet but have it on reserve from ye olde library.
You can listen to it here: http://www.splangy.com/radio/sound.htm
just click on the April 8th show.

[quote]Originally posted by SuNomi
[br]What really distinguishes the two? Is there a 'signature' US sound or influence that set them apart from their compatriots overseas?
[/quote]

The problem is, in my opinion, that the US and UK punk movements were by no means of equal length and time. And, in my view, the respective scenes cannibalized what preceded punk for their inspiration.

Take LA, for instance; it had a vibrant club scene, true, and bands like the Weirdos and the Germs were putting out material before 1980. However, in 1980, the seminal LA punk record--"Los Angeles" by X--was released; after that, there was no smooth downhill decline. Fear put out a couple of good records in the early 80s, and X put out about three genuine classics. After the decay started to set in, you had your hippie, paisley-underground crowd start to come in--making neo-Love, neo-Doors, neo-Dead music; attempting to resurrect the corpse of the love generation. See the Dream Syndicate and the Three O'Clock, for instance.

NYC, however, had a definite breaking point. Television pretty much imploded after "Adventure" in 1978. The Ramones were irrelevant after their third album in 1977. There, you can trace a post-punk scene--mostly no-wave, minimalist stuff like the Contortions, Teenage Jesus & the Jerks, and DNA. I think the nature of the music--dissonant, funky, and hard to take in large doses--has to do with the scene and the people involved. Whereas your average UK post-punk band was young and inspired by Bowie, Roxy Music, et. al., your no wave person was older, artier, and much more inclined towards the Velvet Underground and John Cale--their early-70s predecessors; no wave then pretty much morphed into the minimalist funk of your ESG, your Liquid Liquid, your Konk, et. al.; Sonic Youth, I think, is a decent example of a typical east-cost post-punk band; whereas their contemporaries were content to ride the no-wave wagon off the cliff, Sonic Youth transformed themselves into a wimpy college rock band.

Then we have the troublesome issue of Ohio. Pere Ubu and DEVO were making what we could quantify as post-punk in 1976. Thirty Seconds Over Tokyo isn't a punk record by any means; it defies description unless looked at as an example of post-punk disintegration.

That's my answer. I'm half-asleep, so it's doubtless unsatisfactory, but there you go.

I just finished Rip It Up And Start Again, and it just reaffirmed in my mind that the coolest music 79-84 came out of the UK. While bands like ABC, Spandau Ballet and Visage were chart singles in the UK, we here in the States had Journey, Lionel Ritchie, and Foreigner to deal with.

[quote][i]Originally posted by Ollie Stench[/i]
<br>I just finished Rip It Up And Start Again, and it just reaffirmed in my mind that the coolest music 79-84 came out of the UK. While bands like ABC, Spandau Ballet and Visage were chart singles in the UK, we here in the States had Journey, Lionel Ritchie, and Foreigner to deal with.
[/quote]
True the coolist music did come from the UK but we too had some cool bands also
X
Wall of Voodoo
Lords of the New Church
The Nuns
Romeo Void
The Fleshtones
and so on.....

[quote][i]Originally posted by Ollie Stench[/i]
<br>I just finished Rip It Up And Start Again, and it just reaffirmed in my mind that the coolest music 79-84 came out of the UK. While bands like ABC, Spandau Ballet and Visage were chart singles in the UK, we here in the States had Journey, Lionel Ritchie, and Foreigner to deal with.
[/quote]

Don't forget the UK also had Shakin' Stevens, Wham!, the undistinguised musical career of Tracy Ullman, and the Style Council. And let us not forget that the british did send "Vienna" to number two on the charts, they sent "Shaddup Your Face" to number one. It wasn't all sunshine and roses.

[quote][i]Originally posted by Peter Venkman[/i]
<br>Don't forget the UK also had Shakin' Stevens, Wham!, the undistinguised musical career of Tracy Ullman, and the Style Council. And let us not forget that the british did send "Vienna" to number two on the charts, they sent "Shaddup Your Face" to number one. It wasn't all sunshine and roses.
[/quote]
And Bucks Fizz. [xx(]

Was post-punk really even a movement at all in the US? I never recall anyone pointing to any US band as "post-punk" at the time.

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To me, the classic "post-punk" groups were pretty much all from the UK. There were US groups that had similar sound at the time (Bush-Tetras and Pylon, off the top of my head). But the term 'post-punk' used by music-writers of the day was clearly targeting British groups; I'm pretty certain of that.

Sure, Britain put some goofy novelties and lousy groups on the chart but they clearly had the advantage on the charts at the time. Ever compare a British K-tel album to one from the US during that early 80's era? No comparison.

The US had a pretty vibrant popt-punk scene from what I remember, in addition to the no-wave bands out of NY there was Pylon, Mission Of Burma, Urban Verbs, The Feelies, Human Sexual Response, The Method Actors, Sonic Youth & early REM from the east coast while the west produced the likes of Suburban Lawns, Sleeper, Wall Of Voodoo (more post-punk than new wave), Tuxedomoon, The Fibonaccis, Savage Republic & The Gun Club among others...

US post-punk was more commonly referred to as College Rock, and usually wasn't quite as experimental as the UK version.