Ex-NBA player Paul Shirley ... the voice of reason

[SallyLightfoot]

[quote][i]Originally posted by i_like_lectric_motors[/i]
<br>Again - I recognize a hopeless situation when I see one. Trying to talk common sense into some hyper-emotional moron on a new wave message board clearly falls under that category.[/quote]No need to repeat yourself. I read this nonsense the first time you crapped it out on screen and it hasn't appreciated in value since then.

[coop41]

An interesting article from USA Today. I'll admit, I donated.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/2010 ... ture_N.htm

Some noteworthy items (I cannot vouch for the numbers/stats):
* During the 1990s, the U.S. government spent $100 million trying to improve Haiti's police and justice systems, and had little to show for it

*From 2005 to 2007, the USA tried again, paying a contractor nearly $4 million to improve Haiti's judicial system. There was "no measurable improvement," a government audit found

*After receiving $8.3 billion in foreign aid since 1969, Haiti is 25% poorer than it was in 1945, according to statistics compiled by Nicholas Eberstadt, an economist with the American Enterprise Institute.

*"The problem is not goodwill," he says by e-mail from Haiti. "I don't even think the problem is resources. … The big problem is the lack of accountability, lack of a mechanism to pressure aid agencies into effective, long-term development."

*Current U.S. aid to Haiti is about $300 million a year


Wow.

[SallyLightfoot]

I certainly wouldn't expect anyone at the neo-conservative <a href="http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=American_Enterprise_Institute" target="_new">American Enterprise Institute</a> to have anything positive to say about Haiti. The AEI was one of the main propaganda outlets for the Iraq war, and continues to advocate the invasion of Iran. Promoting democracy by gunpoint is one of their main platforms.

A large percentage of aid provided to Haiti over the years has been to prop up kleptocratic leaders like Duvalier. Because Haiti sits right next to Cuba (well, across a narrow strait called the <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windward_Passage" target="_new00">Windward Passage</a>), during the Cold War were been keen on making sure we bankrolled some dictators in the area.

Poor Haiti doesn't know how the game is played in Washington. If only they would set aside some of their aid money a DC lobbying org, instead of getting tens of millions each year they could pocket <a href="http://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/row/R40213.pdf" target="whatev">2+ Billion every year like Israel and Egypt</a>!

In any case, I'm not here to argue against the fact Haiti is a basket case with gravely serious problems-- the kind which take decades to improve. My point throughout this topic is that <strike>Motors is a deranged asshat</strike> there is an immediate humanitarian crisis that deserves attention. The other long-term problems are going to require international assistance, but also a breakthrough from the people and its government.

[i_like_lectric_motors]

Babble all you want, you ignorant fuckstain ... the fact remains that the only tragedy is that the whole place wasn't wiped out.

[coop41]

ok, that's all fine and dandy, when I loaned my in-law $5,000 and I never saw a penny in return, when they asked a second time I said no.

Should I have donated my money to the relief fund or not? Are the facts from the article incorrect? Based on the statistics and facts I can find, either due to political corruption or idiocy or whatever, bottom line, is my money well spent (other than making me feel better)? Is Haiti worth re-building or with all the cash should we buy plane tickets to some other place?
While someone may not agree with the morality of all of the points that Shirley makes, doesn't he raise some serious concerns? From the little time he spent in Arizona and reading his humorous basketball related blog (for the most part), I didn't get that worked up with his comments although I didn't agree with everything that was said. He has brought up some valid points that I am not sure can be disputed. Had he been more politically correct expressing his viewpoint, would it have been more accurate? Is there anything wrong with the general argument he makes or should we blindly give to every charity that asks? What should we tell everyone to convince them the right thing to do with their money is to donate it to Haiti?

[SallyLightfoot]

I keep hearing from the 'anti-help' crowd that the aid money is going toward rebuilding the infrastructure of the country, Port-au-Prince or other devastated areas-- like some kind of insurance policy. The major charities such as the Red Cross, Oxfam, Unicef etc. are relief organizations, not construction firms.

The money being donated to Haiti is being put toward saving lives, not rebuilding Haiti. The funds are being used to provide immediate basic necessities such as fresh water, food, medicine and temporary shelter for roughly one million people.

Haiti is not poised to score a modern new country from your charitable donations. The donations will help avoid death, mass starvation and disease, and little more.

[i_like_lectric_motors]

[quote][i]Originally posted by SallyLightfoot[/i]
<br>I keep hearing from the 'anti-help' crowd that the aid money is going toward rebuilding the infrastructure of the country, Port-au-Prince or other devastated areas-- like some kind of insurance policy. The major charities such as the Red Cross, Oxfam, Unicef etc. are relief organizations, not construction firms.

The money being donated to Haiti is being put toward saving lives, not rebuilding Haiti. The funds are being used to provide immediate basic necessities such as fresh water, food, medicine and temporary shelter for roughly one million people.

Haiti is not poised to score a modern new country from your charitable donations. The donations will help avoid death, mass starvation and disease, and little more.
[/quote]

And once that's done, then what? They'll be begging for much more, just like they always do. This "disaster" should be viewed more as an opportunity ... a good way to thin the herd ... than it should as something that needs to be fixed.

[SallyLightfoot]

[quote][i]Originally posted by i_like_lectric_motors[/i]
<br>And once that's done, then what? They'll be begging for much more, just like they always do. This "disaster" should be viewed more as an opportunity ... a good way to thin the herd ... than it should as something that needs to be fixed.[/quote]Right, thanks for restating your creepy, genocidal position for the nth time, Talky Tina. <object width="425" height="344"><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/hSy8Ko1vSKQ&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

[Bitter Almonds]

[quote][i]Originally posted by coop41[/i]
<br>An interesting article from USA Today. I'll admit, I donated.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/2010 ... ture_N.htm

Some noteworthy items (I cannot vouch for the numbers/stats):
* During the 1990s, the U.S. government spent $100 million trying to improve Haiti's police and justice systems, and had little to show for it

*From 2005 to 2007, the USA tried again, paying a contractor nearly $4 million to improve Haiti's judicial system. There was "no measurable improvement," a government audit found

*After receiving $8.3 billion in foreign aid since 1969, Haiti is 25% poorer than it was in 1945, according to statistics compiled by Nicholas Eberstadt, an economist with the American Enterprise Institute.

*"The problem is not goodwill," he says by e-mail from Haiti. "I don't even think the problem is resources. … The big problem is the lack of accountability, lack of a mechanism to pressure aid agencies into effective, long-term development."

*Current U.S. aid to Haiti is about $300 million a year


Wow.





[/quote]

<p align="justify">You know that's a drop in the bucket compared to the billions every year dumped into israel - and what do we have to show for [i]that[/i] worthless quagmire? You can pretty much omit Haiti from those stats and insert Colombia, El Salvador and Nicaragua in the 80s (about 8 billion dollars total for nothing other than to prop the military and the contras), Iraq, Afghanistan...


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<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v465/Nuwavghost/dij.gif">

[i_like_lectric_motors]

[quote][i]Originally posted by SallyLightfoot[/i]
Right, thanks for restating your creepy, genocidal position for the nth time, Talky Tina.
[/quote]

When trying to teach something to a simpleton like yourself, repetition is a necessity.

[SallyLightfoot]

[quote][i]Originally posted by i_like_lectric_motors[/i]
<br>When trying to teach something to a simpleton like yourself, repetition is a necessity.[/quote]Well thanks for the enlightening lesson, o wise teacher. Apart from the value of mindless repetition, I think you could lecture a variety of courses, for example:

Philosophy 301: The Philosophy of Amorality
Psych 433: Sociopathy, Neurosis and Self-Delusion
Neuro 224: Special Topic -- Mental Masturbation
Bio 188: Anatomy -- Making Visual Contact with Your Rectum
History 228: Hitler, Stalin and Pol Pot -- Madmen or Misunderstood?
Theatre 328: The Shakespearean Fool on a Modern Stage
Engineering 200: Flawed Design and Failure of Electric Motors

[i_like_lectric_motors]

Thanks, but I'm far too busy with Bitch-Slapping 101: Offending Obvious Welfare and Disability Recipients ON NW Message Boards.

[SallyLightfoot]

[quote][i]Originally posted by i_like_lectric_motors[/i]
<br>Thanks, but I'm far too busy with Bitch-Slapping 101: Offending Obvious Welfare and Disability Recipients ON NW Message Boards.
[/quote]Sure, the GED kindergarten-equivalency course you lead at the Aryan Nation Annex (the trailer behind the local Taystee Freez). I hear the short bus stops there to drop off students. <img src="http://www.brainshavings.com/images/ShortBus.jpg" width="350" height="270">